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my SU-152 is cursed


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TnkDztroyer #1 Posted 01 August 2020 - 06:08 AM

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Almost every time I play this tank we lose! WR 25% and survival ZERO!! But my other tier 7 tds wr's.. 

 

ISU-122S  45%  |   SU-122-44  50%   |   T28  50%  |   WZ 135G  54%  |   (wrs in round figures). 

 

The SU is not worse than any of those. And since I play this tier often in Ratings mode, which doesn't record stats, the true picture is even worse! I think I'd be lucky to win 1 in 5 battles in the SU! It doesn't make sense! 


Edited by TnkDztroyer, 01 August 2020 - 06:12 AM.

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erwin10001 #2 Posted 01 August 2020 - 09:02 AM

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actually your winrate order is quite correct su-122-44 > isu-122s > su-152.   

 

Your expected su-152 winrate should therefore be lower than both su-122-44 and isu-122s

 

So 25% WR is probably RNG due to small number of games played and will increase to 40% over time. 

 

Even that troll I posted about in another page has 27% http://forum.wotblitz.asia/index.php?/topic/20796-suggestions-to-reduce-the-efficiency-of-bots-and-afk-grinders/

 

 

 

 



TnkDztroyer #3 Posted 01 August 2020 - 10:35 AM

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Not sure I follow. Are you saying the SU-152 is not as good a TD as both the 122-44 and 122s, so I should expect a lower WR viz. 40% eventually, in it?


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erwin10001 #4 Posted 01 August 2020 - 11:10 AM

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View PostTnkDztroyer, on 01 August 2020 - 10:35 AM, said:

Not sure I follow. Are you saying the SU-152 is not as good a TD as both the 122-44 and 122s, so I should expect a lower WR viz. 40% eventually, in it?

 

yes, if your su-122-44 is 50% and your isu-122s is 45%, your su-152 winrate should be lower than the first 2 because its not as good a tank as the others.


Edited by erwin10001, 01 August 2020 - 11:10 AM.


TnkDztroyer #5 Posted 01 August 2020 - 11:47 AM

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Ok. I thought the SU was better. that's why I was disappointed in it.

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BossArdnutz #6 Posted 01 August 2020 - 04:39 PM

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That's funny. My WR in those is the other way around: 56% in the 152, 54% in the 122S, and 50% in the 122-44 which I really disliked.

Mind you, I haven't played any of them in the last 30 days.

Lord_Melchett #7 Posted 02 August 2020 - 10:58 PM

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I'm 54% in both su152 and isu122s, and 59% in su122-44, roughly 400 games in each.  As those numbers show, I find 122-44 more effective in battle.

 

SU152 is like KV2.  The big derp and long reload mean that a lot of times winning is in the hands of your team - well, more so than in the other 2 tanks that can out dpm an opponent.



BossArdnutz #8 Posted 02 August 2020 - 11:11 PM

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I struggle with DPM tanks. You only have to miss a shot, or take a hit from a second red tank, for a DPM advantage to disappear, and I experience both more often than not!

The 152 is excellent for administering the coup de grace to wounded reds, though, and that's an ability I can use to win. After all, if the red team has 10,000 hit points in total, you can do 9,993 hit points of damage and still get beaten in a 7-0 steam roll! 

Edited by BossArdnutz, 02 August 2020 - 11:15 PM.


TnkDztroyer #9 Posted 03 August 2020 - 07:21 AM

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View PostLord_Melchett, on 03 August 2020 - 08:58 AM, said:

I'm 54% in both su152 and isu122s, and 59% in su122-44, roughly 400 games in each.  As those numbers show, I find 122-44 more effective in battle.

 

SU152 is like KV2.  The big derp and long reload mean that a lot of times winning is in the hands of your team - well, more so than in the other 2 tanks that can out dpm an opponent.

 

 That's only on the first gun though.

 

 

 


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TnkDztroyer #10 Posted 03 August 2020 - 07:24 AM

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View Posterwin10001, on 01 August 2020 - 09:10 PM, said:

 

yes, if your su-122-44 is 50% and your isu-122s is 45%, your su-152 winrate should be lower than the first 2 because its not as good a tank as the others.

 

I've been playing the su-122-44 and I agree it's better. and it's also a premium which means more credits. I think I'll sell the SU-152, and just play the 44 as my 'go to' t7 TD.


Greens 0 / Reds 7 situation normal..  


BossArdnutz #11 Posted 03 August 2020 - 11:14 PM

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Does it have to be Russian? The Jagdpanther just totally outclasses all the Russian tier VII tank destroyers. You even get a choice of equally viable guns to suit your playstyle.

Who runs the SU-152 with anything other than the 152mm? That just makes it a worse ISU-122S. 152mm, calibrated shells and an ammo loadout that is mostly HE (95mm pen) and HEAT (275mm pen) with just a handful of AP (141mm pen) for dealing with low health light tanks that might survive an HE splash but will neither bounce nor survive the AP hit.

ISU-122S vs SU-122-44 is more interesting. The ISU has way better reload and 50% more gun depression, the SU is slightly more mobile but has significantly better camo. If you're good at working camo values then the SU would be way better but given the opportunity the ISU can bring the pain in pretty spectacular fashion.

 

SU-122-44 is the 8th-worst tier VII TD for relative win rate, and the 2nd-worst Russian tier VII TD. Only the SU-100M1 performs worse. Neither of the others are particularly good, but at least they don't make the 'worst tanks in turret VII' list. Makes me feel better about personally not liking the 122-44.


Edited by BossArdnutz, 03 August 2020 - 11:27 PM.


Lord_Melchett #12 Posted 04 August 2020 - 12:21 AM

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View PostTnkDztroyer, on 03 August 2020 - 07:24 AM, said:

 

I've been playing the su-122-44 and I agree it's better. and it's also a premium which means more credits. I think I'll sell the SU-152, and just play the 44 as my 'go to' t7 TD.


No, no, no, don't sell the SU152.  Even if you don't play it often, it will be there waiting for when you need some derp therapy...



Lord_Melchett #13 Posted 04 August 2020 - 12:25 AM

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Well, if you are opening up to non-Russians, most of them are "better", i.e. more effective, than the SU152: T25AT, Jagdpanther, ChiTo SPG are all top class, and among the most effective tier 7 tanks period.

 

If you haven't played t25AT since its last buff, get it out.  I think it's the best tier 7 TD at present.  Mobile, effective gun, good gun depression and very solid frontal armour.



Lord_Melchett #14 Posted 04 August 2020 - 12:29 AM

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View PostBossArdnutz, on 03 August 2020 - 11:14 PM, said:

ISU-122S vs SU-122-44 is more interesting. The ISU has way better reload and 50% more gun depression, the SU is slightly more mobile but has significantly better camo. If you're good at working camo values then the SU would be way better but given the opportunity the ISU can bring the pain in pretty spectacular fashion.

 

SU-122-44 is the 8th-worst tier VII TD for relative win rate, and the 2nd-worst Russian tier VII TD. Only the SU-100M1 performs worse. Neither of the others are particularly good, but at least they don't make the 'worst tanks in turret VII' list. Makes me feel better about personally not liking the 122-44.

 Both ISU122S and Su122-44 can be highly effective.  I find it interesting that while I win more battles in the 122-44, I have way more masteries in the ISU122S ...

 

And it doesn't surprise me that 100M1 is the worst performing generally.  It takes a while to work out how to be effective with practically no gun depression.  Once you get that worked out, it is a really good td.



TnkDztroyer #15 Posted 04 August 2020 - 01:40 AM

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View PostLord_Melchett, on 04 August 2020 - 10:29 AM, said:

 Both ISU122S and Su122-44 can be highly effective.  I find it interesting that while I win more battles in the 122-44, I have way more masteries in the ISU122S ...

 

And it doesn't surprise me that 100M1 is the worst performing generally.  It takes a while to work out how to be effective with practically no gun depression.  Once you get that worked out, it is a really good td.

 

1/  the 122-44 can be bought in the store, but the ISU-122S is not available. So I guess maybe the 44 is more common/popular. That might explain it.

2/  what is the best way to do that?

 


Edited by TnkDztroyer, 04 August 2020 - 01:46 AM.

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Lord_Melchett #16 Posted 04 August 2020 - 04:27 AM

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View PostTnkDztroyer, on 04 August 2020 - 01:40 AM, said:

 

1/  the 122-44 can be bought in the store, but the ISU-122S is not available. So I guess maybe the 44 is more common/popular. That might explain it.

2/  what is the best way to do that?

 

You could be right about the relative popularity of the tanks.

 

You need to find places where you can be flat or slightly downslope.  Around ridges, you need to go wider so that you can stay flat.  Essentially, you fight from the bottom or edges of hills and ridges, rather than the ridgelines.  There are many such places when you (have to) start looking.

 

 



BossArdnutz #17 Posted 04 August 2020 - 08:51 AM

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I've been avoiding both the SU-100M1 line and the WZ-120 for that exact reason...

TnkDztroyer #18 Posted 04 August 2020 - 09:40 AM

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View PostLord_Melchett, on 04 August 2020 - 02:27 PM, said:

You could be right about the relative popularity of the tanks.

 

You need to find places where you can be flat or slightly downslope.  Around ridges, you need to go wider so that you can stay flat.  Essentially, you fight from the bottom or edges of hills and ridges, rather than the ridgelines.  There are many such places when you (have to) start looking.

 

 

 

yep, I had already figured out those. been caught out too many times peeking out to shoot and not been able to bring the gun on target.


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