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Loosing streaks - across Accounts


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TinDingo #21 Posted 01 July 2018 - 01:19 AM

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View PostGandalf__Greyhame, on 29 June 2018 - 05:00 AM, said:

 

This is an ancient conspiracy theory / excuse people use . Unless you have actual evidence that MM is rigged you can zip it .

 

The MM was designed by WG.

There's your evidence.


Every system is perfectly designed to produce exactly the results that it produces


TinDingo #22 Posted 01 July 2018 - 01:26 AM

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View PostCaptain_Par, on 30 June 2018 - 06:33 AM, said:

 

Maybe you're just too focused on improving your winrate, you've actually stopped enjoying the game. It sort of has become a quest for you hasn't it to get the best winrate etc to flaunt it obviously. My advice probably wont even matter but it has made me enjoy this game for what it is. I've stopped caring about winrate, damage ratio and other stats, i play to play simple. You lose or you win stay humble and people will like you for that, ive talked sense into a few ragers after a loss and some have appreciated it. So stop looking at stats and just play. Free advice take it or leave it.

 

The system which is WOTB is designed around stats and getting players to care about stats.

This is done in order to get players to spend money in the hope that their stats will improve (premium time/tanks = more credits = more gold ammo = more damage = better stats).

 

By not caring about your stats you have beaten the system.

Well done!


Every system is perfectly designed to produce exactly the results that it produces


Haubitzenschmitz #23 Posted 01 July 2018 - 01:51 AM

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View PostTinDingo, on 01 July 2018 - 01:26 AM, said:

 

The system which is WOTB is designed around stats and getting players to care about stats.

This is done in order to get players to spend money in the hope that their stats will improve (premium time/tanks = more credits = more gold ammo = more damage = better stats).

 

By not caring about your stats you have beaten the system.

Well done!

 

All correct, the extensive Stat, and WR system has been introduced by WG - BUT it also has been supported, sustained and even lauded by a overwhelming part of the community!

The competitive aspect in this game is hence omnipresent. 

 

And even WG has realised lately that the more competition there is the less fun it is to play.... 

 
I am not saying that it is not possible to have fun on your own, or with a buddy, in an alternative community.... but on the other hand it is kind of hard to beat both, the system and the overall developement.
It's like going to the Olympic games, or being in a football team at the world cup, for having fun... it's possible, but kind of counterintuitive LOL
 
 


Creighton_Abrams #24 Posted 01 July 2018 - 06:34 AM

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I've run a test, setting up a new account, just focusing upon Russian LT line.  Super Unicum over the first 13 battles no problem. Got the BT-7 art as part of  this year's Birthday prize award, and started doing well in order to get some credits,  but after 10 games or so, its winrate tanked, every game I entered using that tank, we lost.  20 or so games later that tank's WR is down to 30%... seriously 10 games in a row lost.... Sure, that tank is a Credit winner, and according to BlitzStars I'm still above average in that tank (baring wins) even though the win rate is abysmal.

 

I played a couple of other new accounts in parallel to this, they didn't loose - but, I didn't play as many games as the first in each.  So, arguments about Psychology do not apply....  

(Note: in one I lost the 1st 3 games, and still held the Bltiz stars "Super Unicum" status, so that status really doesn't say much for small number of battles)

 

One observation, during the initial induction to the game, you play Tier I and II out in Regular battles, in the early hours of the morning, the Seal Clubbers are often on the opposing team .  This consistent mix, doesn't seem right, and were new players fussy about such things, could put them off.   Similarly, the more you play the same tank, the more chance you have of hitting a loosing streak (which is inline with my observations upon the BT7 art in my 1st account) - given the changes relating to Parts for Cash only, and the reduced Cash drop rate from Crates, this loosing streak relationship between playing the same tank over and over again, becomes an issue - since that's exactly what you're going to do, if you're a new player trying just one line of tanks (as is always recommended).

 

Also WG should fix the crates - Purchasing a new one is all too easily done by accidentally double clicking, and 65K credits gone straight away - which for a Newbie... is a lot - perhaps too much, I made that mistake once....

 

Bottom line, I do not, believe that Loosing streaks are random, and are not always Psychologically driven.   Bad game play is another matter, but then given the number of players active at any time, you'd expect a balance of good/bad per team - which does not happen when the other side wins hands down consistently 7-0 or 6-1, or 5-2.

 

 

 



Haubitzenschmitz #25 Posted 01 July 2018 - 07:50 AM

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View PostCreighton_Abrams, on 01 July 2018 - 06:34 AM, said:

 

 

Bottom line, I do not, believe that Loosing streaks are random, and are not always Psychologically driven.   Bad game play is another matter, but then given the number of players active at any time, you'd expect a balance of good/bad per team - which does not happen when the other side wins hands down consistently 7-0 or 6-1, or 5-2.

 

 

 

 

As you may have noticed, I am with you on this part... 

Only when you open or run "experimental accounts", you will notice when and how (other) oddities occur... and how likely it is that certain things are neither random nor coincidence.

True, psychology matters and so do your choices and decisions in each game. But it is as obvious, that they do not cancel each other out, nor does one prevent the other.

Bushka lately wanted to point out that it is neither the noobs in your team, nor MM, no anything else fishy... but ONLY you.... But however he perceives it for himself, the simplest LOGIC tells

us that one does not exclude the other. And more importantly, it is even more obvious that "engineered irregularities" would emphasise and multiply other factors. And that is exactly how it looks!

 

Besides: WG is very concerned about the new players in Blitz or the actual noobs so to speak, who (ironically) suffer most from such "irregularities", especially because of the increasing number

of SEAL CLUBBERS. Sure, if you have yet an additional parameter (seal clubbing of various levels in the lowest tiers) that is against you and your luck, well you get the picture! And they are about to change a number of things (as I have overheard very recently) in lower tiers. Notably thinning out the tech tree in 1-4 Tiers (sifting out the most OP thanks) and likely replacing them with premiums. Not confirmed, just overheard it, like some others may have. And in addition, they want to change other things because they have noticed that numerous new players seem to get scared away very quickly because they get flogged so badly in the game.

 

 

 



Creighton_Abrams #26 Posted 01 July 2018 - 08:34 AM

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I have my scepticism over some of the things WG tells us, and justified too - for example, on the one hand they say HE does not bounce, and on the other I have experienced it often. 

 

Sometimes when the other team wins, having looked at their details I see no evidence of them being Seal clubbers, but with only my view point of that game I can assume that everyone else in the team had the misfortune for shots doing minimal damage, or flying off target.   (This is the RNG some put it down to, though I still think its controlled - but we will never find out, unless we're given access to the code... which aint going to happen.)

 

Granted some of the players need to learn how to control their tank - I know that if I were to play the iPad version then I would have difficulty getting to grip with the controls more than I would a PC, though at present, for new comers, there's no where other than the Battles to practice - Training Rooms aren't even introduced during the Induction sessions. Perhaps, if Training rooms with BOTs were setup then more users would be encouraged to practice... but they should have 0 cost in terms of Credits, as they have 0 impact upon your Stats.

 

 



PressFtoPayRespects #27 Posted 01 July 2018 - 09:13 AM

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*checks thread that complains that mm is rigged*

 

*checks OP player stats*

 

*checked most played tanks*

 

*KV2*

 

*45% win rate*

 

*735 average damage*

 

*doesn't even have an ace tanker in it*

 

:facepalm:

 

 


Edited by PressFtoPayRespects, 01 July 2018 - 09:40 AM.


PressFtoPayRespects #28 Posted 01 July 2018 - 09:37 AM

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Yes MM is rigged. It's not random cos they don't put al the high win rate players on one side and the low win rate players on the other. like what someone else mentioned it would lead to too extreme results= not good for the game.

 

So imo they rig it, try their best to balance the teams in best possible way. honestly if you are a good player you should be winning more than 50% of the time, no problemo. yet all you conspiracy theorists ever do is create threads, whine that mm is rigged against u and other stuff like that. it is evident from your stats you aren't performing up to standards lmao.

 

even if mm is rigged against u, i seriously doubt that they are placing career average 60%+wr teams against u and 40%+ wr teammates. at most, i believe that win rate differences are about 5%, max.

 

but of course you all think too highly of yourselves, instead of blaming of your mistakes you blame your teammates too much, complain WG is out against u etc. that's the difference between the players in the wr range 40%-50%, and the unicums/superunicums spamming tier 10. 

 

you can't control what WG gives you. you can only control your teammates decisions to a limited extent. but at least you can control yours, so you can just work on minimising the mistakes you make.

 

you won't win 100% of the time of course, but at least in maybe 100 games, in 5 of those games which could have been defeats, you having less mistakes helped you win those 5 matches. a 5%wr increase, which is pretty impressive.

 

 

 

 



Creighton_Abrams #29 Posted 01 July 2018 - 11:04 AM

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Well PressF1... so you focus on 1 tank my KV-2 and just jump to conclusions. That tank used to be good, but for me no longer, and regardless if I play better in it, it wont make much impact on the stats because I've played it so many in it.  I played it recently and it just hits the ground (WG NERF'ing) when properly aimed. So its pointless doing anything about it.

 

Perhaps rather than Trolling the Forum if you have something moe constructive to offer then do so... otherwise you are just a discouragement for anyone to play this game.    

 

Also, if you put $ into the game, then you dont need to hard grind, you can instantly get the best of the tank, crew, etc, fire AP all the time, etc.(which makes a big difference if you end up lowest tier and all Red tanks are literally red except with AP, so I think, I can ... speak with a little more experience [all beit at loosing] than you I guess....

 

Now, to add further to the observations above, I see the same repeat issue happening in another of my new accounts - the more you play the same tank, the worse things become in it.  e.g. BT-7 art   (30  games win rate 70%, rest of team 32-44% 19k-600 games each, red team 64-37%, 6k-100 games - stats don't matter, they win 6-1... I took the 1). The odd things I've noticed during that game were (1) shots did no less dmg than expected (2) auto-aim likes to fire at the ground ... these are symptoms I've seen in other games when I know something is amiss, and conversely, when I've played a real bad shot and it 1-shots a tank, I know we're going to win. 

 

 

 


Edited by Creighton_Abrams, 01 July 2018 - 03:09 PM.


__CrazyCat__ #30 Posted 02 July 2018 - 06:40 AM

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My personal opinion is that 'rigged' is a strong word but there is definitely something going on in the MM. How many times do you have a run of like 10 wins where the teams you get are far superior than your opponents, sometimes hugely with 39% players with 200 games making up the opposing team - then almost like a switch, the next 10 you find yourself in those kind of teams?

 

Now, I have been playing here for four years now and I can tell you that it was not always the case as it was possible to put far longer runs of wins together and the MM just felt more naturally random. Sure you could get some bad luck with teams and still suffer losing streaks but the teams always seemed more evenly matched. it was very rare to have such an obvious 'good' team and obvious 'bad' team. You could still lose 7-0 and the like but it was a lot less frequent back then.

 

That is why i think WG has implemented something within their MM to keep poor players from becoming too frustrated and allowing them to win more frequently.

 

A post by 'face4star' on the EU forums - the creator of WOTBSTARS (an alternative to Blitzstars that many people preferred) which he has now stopped working on and left the game due to the MM being manipulated.

 

"I will explain how algorithm of MM is rigged to end this once and for all. At least how I see it is rigged against strong players. It is not rigged to make someone lose all the time but actually to make weak players to win more often at expense of strong players. WarGaming has a huge playerbase - most of it are low IQ individuals, who play on cheap poor performing devices, without a serious motivation to apply a substantial effort to win.  However even being  bad at everything else those are still good as customers as they have money and even better stupid people usually part with their money quite easily (e.g buying credits or gamble with crates).

 

So to not lose clients like these WG builds teams of weak players not without giving them one or two  strong players in order to help them to win and make them happy (willing to continue playing). First WG builds a team of players and if it sees that the team is too weak to carry on its own it adds to it a strong player currently available in the queue. If a number of strong players is not as large but number of weak players is high (e.g Halloween event scenario) then strong players continuously end up as one or max two guys spawned in a weak team with an equally built opponents. What the problem with this and how it is rigged against strong players versus the situation when strong players are spawned at completely random teams with an equal chance to see another strong player on its, another or neither side?

 

1) There is obvious winrate transition from strong players to weak players as strong players are sharing with weak players their wins and weak players share with strong players their losses.

 

2) Performance of a strong player is highly influenced by a tank he is driving. If a strong player is driving a team dependent tank (Emil, T-37) he is most likely going to lose comparing to a strong player in the opposite team if that one drives a universal (not team dependent) tank (IS-6, KV-4 etc) because a weak team likely to let the first player down. 

 

3) As weak players performance is random but strong players at both teams are about to be equal then their final win rate is to be about equal in such battles and be around 50% depending on which tanks are chosen and which maps are offered. It might be perfect result for weak players but definitely not good enough for strong players. 

 

4) Platoon players have a little advantage as they are spawned at weak teams at pairs, when MM is not always capable to find a similar platoon to enforce opposite team in a similar way. Usually two strong players in platoon are better than one or two strong players who are picked at random. Rule 4 is quadrupled for super-unicum platoons as finding another super-unicum platoon to put in opposite team is not possible at every given moment. This way super-unicum platoon are effectively enjoying a free ride and are (partially) exempt from MM rigging / win-rate sharing.

 

5) Strong players have no backup and a minimal mistake would ruin game of the entire team so they have to make a substantially higher contribution in order to achieve the same goal. When weak players do a mistake it is not so critical as by definition their weight in the team is not heavy. What it essentially means that like in my particular case it was not enough to make 1200-1300 dmg per game in T-37 in order to get 50% winrate when for an average weak player it is enough to make 800 dmg to get 52%. It also makes life of strong players hell when they operate stock tanks without upgraded crew because in this situation their chances to carry are handicapped but responsibilities remain the same. Weak players could not care less if they operate a stock tank or not as winning is not their job - it is delegated to a strong player assigned to their team. Weak player is meat shield, dmg sponge etc ... 

 

At the end WG is turning strong players in an instrument of entertaining weak players. So strong players are nothing else but work horses that have to pull weak teams. I am not going to get into socialism/capitalism discussion but this is an example of how socialism work and how it fails."

 

"I was planning to shut down site for a long time. As some of you know I stopped playing around a year go when I first discovered to myself a pattern of MM rigging. It was about a year ago when one of the updates introduced this algorithm. Then around two months ago I came back to the game just to figure out that nothing changed and only got worse. This is my opinion but as a human I am entitled to have one.

 

The main reason I came back to playing this game is that I was not able to run the site without seeing what is going inside it. The game is changing all the time, new lines are introduced, rules are changing - it is required to be a part of it in order to keep a relevant site. My frustration was growing as I noticed a complete disregard to my effort from WG. They seems to could not care less about third party extensions to their eco system. It goes in a sharp contrast with industry approaches when companies trying to reward contributors. For example eBay rewarded me with a power seller status/discount and a formal latter of recognition for being good at sales on their site. I have not done much for eBay but they found time to acknowledge even that. I never got anything from WG - no tanks, no WG club badges, not a symbolic gold investment in my account to buy a premium camo. In opposite they were using me as a workhorse to stimulate weaker teams as many other senior players. I never got help resolving issues with API they have. Even after asking forum admins to hook me up with WG devs in order to resolve API question nothing happened. Getting information from WG is impossible - they provide zero assistance for sites like mine besides the information available on their API portal. In case of any problem (missing tanks for example) they direct people back to my website even the real problem lies in their API.

 

The site itself was not easy to maintain. Income from the site was never high but was gradually coming down over months making a perspective of going into red very real. I have stopped asking for donations 2 years ago after it was a couple of months when it was none. The last draw was this forum post that I made about a disconnect between my performance in T37 and my stats. It was my first post this year - and who say that I rant all the time should check the history. I did not post anything on forum in 2017. The first response I got was "You deserve it". Well if this is what community thinks, then I do not want to be a free servant of this community. I have my life too and trust me my life is not easy. So bottom line is - I have my reasons to leave this game. I am not a drama queen. It is just a wrong project to be in. It does not bring any satisfaction - not financial, not mental. I will put my talent at work at some other venture and leave business of making stats site to people who still enjoy the game or to the developers who have financial reasons to be in charge of it."


Edited by __CrazyCat__, 02 July 2018 - 06:44 AM.


MontMont #31 Posted 02 July 2018 - 10:14 AM

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Thanks crazycat that was an excellent spray about WG and there rigged MM. A while back I had winning streak of 22 games one afternoon, and I've never come anywhere close to that since, 4 games at the most. Something with MM really changed in the last twelve months and I'm so glad so many players are now telling what they believe is a fact and not some figment of our imagination. Another thing if you have multiple accounts regardless of the number games played in them the rigged MM happens to each of them. I've also noticed that if you see the red marker alerting you of a new news item and you check it and then log into one of your other accounts the red marker won't be there but the news item is. I'm not a tech guru but I guess WG matches your ISP address and that's why this happens and also why the rigged MM occurs on all of your accounts.

Gandalf__Greyhame #32 Posted 02 July 2018 - 02:14 PM

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View Post__CrazyCat__, on 02 July 2018 - 06:40 AM, said:

My personal opinion is that 'rigged' is a strong word but there is definitely something going on in the MM. How many times do you have a run of like 10 wins where the teams you get are far superior than your opponents, sometimes hugely with 39% players with 200 games making up the opposing team - then almost like a switch, the next 10 you find yourself in those kind of teams?

 

Now, I have been playing here for four years now and I can tell you that it was not always the case as it was possible to put far longer runs of wins together and the MM just felt more naturally random. Sure you could get some bad luck with teams and still suffer losing streaks but the teams always seemed more evenly matched. it was very rare to have such an obvious 'good' team and obvious 'bad' team. You could still lose 7-0 and the like but it was a lot less frequent back then.

 

That is why i think WG has implemented something within their MM to keep poor players from becoming too frustrated and allowing them to win more frequently.

 

A post by 'face4star' on the EU forums - the creator of WOTBSTARS (an alternative to Blitzstars that many people preferred) which he has now stopped working on and left the game due to the MM being manipulated.

 

"I will explain how algorithm of MM is rigged to end this once and for all. At least how I see it is rigged against strong players. It is not rigged to make someone lose all the time but actually to make weak players to win more often at expense of strong players. WarGaming has a huge playerbase - most of it are low IQ individuals, who play on cheap poor performing devices, without a serious motivation to apply a substantial effort to win.  However even being  bad at everything else those are still good as customers as they have money and even better stupid people usually part with their money quite easily (e.g buying credits or gamble with crates).

 

So to not lose clients like these WG builds teams of weak players not without giving them one or two  strong players in order to help them to win and make them happy (willing to continue playing). First WG builds a team of players and if it sees that the team is too weak to carry on its own it adds to it a strong player currently available in the queue. If a number of strong players is not as large but number of weak players is high (e.g Halloween event scenario) then strong players continuously end up as one or max two guys spawned in a weak team with an equally built opponents. What the problem with this and how it is rigged against strong players versus the situation when strong players are spawned at completely random teams with an equal chance to see another strong player on its, another or neither side?

 

1) There is obvious winrate transition from strong players to weak players as strong players are sharing with weak players their wins and weak players share with strong players their losses.

 

2) Performance of a strong player is highly influenced by a tank he is driving. If a strong player is driving a team dependent tank (Emil, T-37) he is most likely going to lose comparing to a strong player in the opposite team if that one drives a universal (not team dependent) tank (IS-6, KV-4 etc) because a weak team likely to let the first player down. 

 

3) As weak players performance is random but strong players at both teams are about to be equal then their final win rate is to be about equal in such battles and be around 50% depending on which tanks are chosen and which maps are offered. It might be perfect result for weak players but definitely not good enough for strong players. 

 

4) Platoon players have a little advantage as they are spawned at weak teams at pairs, when MM is not always capable to find a similar platoon to enforce opposite team in a similar way. Usually two strong players in platoon are better than one or two strong players who are picked at random. Rule 4 is quadrupled for super-unicum platoons as finding another super-unicum platoon to put in opposite team is not possible at every given moment. This way super-unicum platoon are effectively enjoying a free ride and are (partially) exempt from MM rigging / win-rate sharing.

 

5) Strong players have no backup and a minimal mistake would ruin game of the entire team so they have to make a substantially higher contribution in order to achieve the same goal. When weak players do a mistake it is not so critical as by definition their weight in the team is not heavy. What it essentially means that like in my particular case it was not enough to make 1200-1300 dmg per game in T-37 in order to get 50% winrate when for an average weak player it is enough to make 800 dmg to get 52%. It also makes life of strong players hell when they operate stock tanks without upgraded crew because in this situation their chances to carry are handicapped but responsibilities remain the same. Weak players could not care less if they operate a stock tank or not as winning is not their job - it is delegated to a strong player assigned to their team. Weak player is meat shield, dmg sponge etc ... 

 

The guy has written a lot but provides no real evidence . It is just your usual rant posted in an elaborate manner . So let us go over it one by one :

1. Better players contribute more towards winning than weaker players ..... duh ... yeah ? That is common sense . Ronaldo contributes more towards their team winning than others . Is this even a valid point which shows rigged MM ?

2. If a strong player drives a weak tank then he is more likely to lose .... again .... yeah ? You are the strongest player and you are handicapped coz you are driving a St Emil or something compared to the strong player on red team who is in a Drac ... duh ... yeah . Is this evidence of rigged MM ?

3. Okay now he is just blabbering .... he is saying if two strong players meet then your win rate is 50% and this reduces their wr but improves wr of weaker players . So you don't want to meet strong players coz that reduces your wr ? I mean what point is he trying to make ?

4. " Platoon players have a little advantage as they are spawned at weak teams at pairs, when MM is not always capable to find a similar platoon to enforce opposite team in a similar way " .... whata ? "  Usually two strong players in platoon are better than one or two strong players who are picked at random. " .... duh ... yeah coz they are likely to have better understanding / be in voice chat etc. 

5 . Point 5 is again a rehash of his previous points . A stronger player has more responsibility than a weaker player . When a stronger player makes a mistake it costs the team a lot more than when a weak player makes a mistake .... yes ... when Messi can't score Argentina loses . Is this evidence for rigged MM ? 

So basically all his 5 points are the same and offer no evidence to support rigged MM conspiracy theory . 



__ForGlory__ #33 Posted 02 July 2018 - 03:07 PM

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View PostGandalf__Greyhame, on 02 July 2018 - 02:14 PM, said:

The guy has written a lot but provides no real evidence . It is just your usual rant posted in an elaborate manner . So let us go over it one by one :

1. Better players contribute more towards winning than weaker players ..... duh ... yeah ? That is common sense . Ronaldo contributes more towards their team winning than others . Is this even a valid point which shows rigged MM ?

2. If a strong player drives a weak tank then he is more likely to lose .... again .... yeah ? You are the strongest player and you are handicapped coz you are driving a St Emil or something compared to the strong player on red team who is in a Drac ... duh ... yeah . Is this evidence of rigged MM ?

3. Okay now he is just blabbering .... he is saying if two strong players meet then your win rate is 50% and this reduces their wr but improves wr of weaker players . So you don't want to meet strong players coz that reduces your wr ? I mean what point is he trying to make ?

4. " Platoon players have a little advantage as they are spawned at weak teams at pairs, when MM is not always capable to find a similar platoon to enforce opposite team in a similar way " .... whata ? "  Usually two strong players in platoon are better than one or two strong players who are picked at random. " .... duh ... yeah coz they are likely to have better understanding / be in voice chat etc. 

5 . Point 5 is again a rehash of his previous points . A stronger player has more responsibility than a weaker player . When a stronger player makes a mistake it costs the team a lot more than when a weak player makes a mistake .... yes ... when Messi can't score Argentina loses . Is this evidence for rigged MM ? 

So basically all his 5 points are the same and offer no evidence to support rigged MM conspiracy theory . 

 

To be fair the guy has a hell of a lot of data on the game and his opinions correlate with mine - sure he might not have absolute evidence but this will be impossible to get. The timing is also very similar to how I felt a change within the MM.

 

I have been here long enough to have noticed that change and I am far from the only one that believes that MM is bit random. If you do not think games manipulate their MM in order to suit their business - take a look at this ;- https://kotaku.com/activision-patents-matchmaking-that-encourages-players-1819630937

 



__ForGlory__ #34 Posted 02 July 2018 - 03:09 PM

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View PostMontMont, on 02 July 2018 - 10:14 AM, said:

Thanks crazycat that was an excellent spray about WG and there rigged MM. A while back I had winning streak of 22 games one afternoon, and I've never come anywhere close to that since, 4 games at the most. Something with MM really changed in the last twelve months and I'm so glad so many players are now telling what they believe is a fact and not some figment of our imagination. Another thing if you have multiple accounts regardless of the number games played in them the rigged MM happens to each of them. I've also noticed that if you see the red marker alerting you of a new news item and you check it and then log into one of your other accounts the red marker won't be there but the news item is. I'm not a tech guru but I guess WG matches your ISP address and that's why this happens and also why the rigged MM occurs on all of your accounts.

 

Yep I had similar win streaks, in the 20's, in the teens and I would also experience losing streaks sometimes too. On the whole though, you could win 1, lose 1, win 1, lose 1 as it was random. These days it is so obviously pre-determined which team will likely win (sure, there can be surprises, managed to pull a few off myself).

erwin10001 #35 Posted 02 July 2018 - 04:11 PM

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In an earlier thread, I mentioned how you can verify rigged MM

This is how you test:

 

Platoon 1 comprising high winrate unicum

Platoon 2 comprising average winrate players

 

Platoon1 presses battle first, 0.5 second later, Platoon 2 presses battle.

Since platoon 1 pressed battle first, MM should find a game for it first?

But what if platoon 2 consistently finds a game first?

 

 



bigben21 #36 Posted 02 July 2018 - 05:46 PM

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Lol debating whether MM is rigged again. This topic has been debated “rigorously” numerous times.

 

Anyway, I do concur with crazycat’s comment that “rigged” is actually a word too strong to describe mm. Imo, mm can be and is manipulated as we play wotb.

 

Ever wonder why are we almost at the higher tier when we start to play a new tank. Do you even realise we almost have relatively easier first few games with these new tanks.

 

Mm can be manipulated but imo I don’t think its rigged or purposely to target a person to make that person to suffer prolonged defeats for a certain period of time.

 

Losing streak do happen. After a few bad experiences with losing streaks I have learned not to play (or play) in a certain time. Eg. I have not played a single game since the start of the World Cup, suspecting that many good players will not be playing wotb, resulting in a more unbalanced mm. Reason, In a situation when there Were lesser better players, the chances of one being drawn into a “mediocre” team is higher. Hence no matter how hard I tried, I usually ended up losing and frustrated. I ever lost 30 games in a row. And the next few nights I played was equally bad, losing rate was like 80%. Therefore, experience told me not to play during certain  period eg. when there are likely to have lesser better players. Indeed my experience with losing streaks and the frustration that comes with it has been greatly reduced.


Edited by bigben21, 02 July 2018 - 05:48 PM.


Ambulant #37 Posted 03 July 2018 - 03:14 AM

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Agree with bigben21 about choosing your time of play. But my bugbear is events. There might be MM rigging or not, but the events almost always lower the level of gameplay and it can get pretty bad at times. Already the HTCs are out in droves... How do you choose a good time to play during events when so many guys are driving around without thinking?



Lord_Melchett #38 Posted 03 July 2018 - 04:54 AM

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This recent thread on NA server is the best actual evidence analysing many battles that I have seen: http://forum.wotblitz.com/index.php?/topic/92842-what-100-battles-have-told-me-about-win-rate-mm-and-the-players-of-blitz/

 

Everything else posted is anecdotal and, my personal opinion, heavily influenced by confirmation bias.  I'm often guilty of the latter - I think I'm (e.g.) low tier a lot, so I pay attention to when I'm low tier, and not when I'm high tier - it's very easy to do.  I've had long winning streaks and long losing streaks, and accept both as confluences of random MM, tank choices, my skill and the skills of the other players;  and, of course, a hefty dose of RNG.


 

The gunner in my IS5, on the other hand, is clearly being paid off by WG to make me lose . . .


Edited by Lord_Melchett, 03 July 2018 - 04:54 AM.


Gandalf__Greyhame #39 Posted 03 July 2018 - 06:08 AM

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View PostLord_Melchett, on 03 July 2018 - 04:54 AM, said:

This recent thread on NA server is the best actual evidence analysing many battles that I have seen: http://forum.wotblitz.com/index.php?/topic/92842-what-100-battles-have-told-me-about-win-rate-mm-and-the-players-of-blitz/

 

Everything else posted is anecdotal and, my personal opinion, heavily influenced by confirmation bias.  I'm often guilty of the latter - I think I'm (e.g.) low tier a lot, so I pay attention to when I'm low tier, and not when I'm high tier - it's very easy to do.  I've had long winning streaks and long losing streaks, and accept both as confluences of random MM, tank choices, my skill and the skills of the other players;  and, of course, a hefty dose of RNG.


 

The gunner in my IS5, on the other hand, is clearly being paid off by WG to make me lose . . .

 

Thanx Lord Melchett for the link . You see , that post  is talking about actual stats and evidence and not just based on personal feeling . One must appreciate the effort the guy made . Now if you look into what he found out :

1. Majority of players are between 45 and 55 WR . 

2. Team with better WR has a greater chance of winning .

3. This guy got a green team with better WR ( even if we discount his own 65% wr , his team still had better wr in 67 games ) - This goes against the popular narrative that high WR players are penalized by putting them with crappy teams . The other post by another guy was solely focused on saying that high wr players have to suffer due to being put in low wr teams . Here this guys data is showing exactly the opposite thing . 

 4. He makes a very important point ," A player with a higher wr is not paired with low wr team mates to 'even out' the the two teams " . Even I was personally convinced that this was the most likely scenario .He basically puts a death star hesh round straight through the popular argument that high wr players are put in low wr teams to drag down their wr . 

5. He says quality of platoon does matter . This is again opposite to some earlier post which said platoons are irrelevant unless they are 75% plus superunicum plats . In fact when playing in plat and when plats on both side were removed he still had a favorable wr in 75% of games which is massive . I mean this is a 65% player , WG is supposed to be dragging his wr down but MM is actually giving him favorable teams .

6. He is 65% player . The earlier guy had written that a blue player faces another blue or purple player all the time and so their WR as he puts comes down to 50% which decreases both their wr's but actually increases the wr of those 40% noobs . Here this guy is saying he faced a 60% wr player in only 16% battles . Shocking isn't it . 

 Now it is possible that WG were really smart and they knew he was doing this and temporarily shut down the rigging . But this is what I was calling for , some real data even if limited to 100 games . His data even if it does not fully prove or disprove the rigged MM conspiracy theory is still based on solid stats and shows us the way forward .



Gandalf__Greyhame #40 Posted 03 July 2018 - 06:14 AM

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Right now my phone is broken so not really playing much . Planning to get a new phone in the next two or three days . I will do something similar so that we can have some similar stats from the perspective of a 50% wr player . Will put these stats on when I'm finished . I will encourage others to do the same . You don't have to go into so much detail as he did . Even if you note down the wr of two teams over 20 or 30 games that should also be enough .




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